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The latest issue of the 9th Scroll is here! You can read all about it in the news.

  • Yeah that looks like nice correlation. Gaban is an outlier but he did have imo an uncompetitive list, the unit choices which also did not get discounted enough. Otherwise the update did address the issues fairly well. Thanks for putting the work in

  • It would be good to see how well each list above did as well, how many points each scored to then see if there is any correlation between discount and points scored.

  • @nantuko I bet its msu consisting of 3x6 heath riders, 3 dancers, 4 units of rangers and some warhawks.

  • @nantuko yes possibly a fast list can work with no points spent on bsb, do you feel those units have become worthwhile with this update?

  • Quote from Wesser: “Quote from Alexwellace: “Druid; General, Eagle King, Master, Druidism/Shamanism. 405 Chieftain; BSB, Elven Horse + Light troops. 235 10 Heath Hunters. 375 10 Heath Hunters. 375 10 Heath Hunters. 375 4 Thicket Beasts. 365 4 Thicket Beasts. 365 4 Thicket Beasts. 365 Treefather. 435 Treefather. 435 4 Kestrel Knights; Shields. 385 4 Kestrel Knights; Shields. 385 4500 This list has has managed to get 155pts cheaper. It's not even a list I'd have ever played before, characters are …

  • The list of changes are in the change log at the back of the document. Briar maidens going down in price from 200 to 195, heath hunters being 205.... Does core tax exist? 30 points for an extra lady means nothing to chaff units that you want to keep as lean as possible. A single champ might see play to make use of break the spirit but if that spell was not worth the investment before, the 5 point discount won't change the fact. Beastmen have had a shooting spear since start of 9th.

  • Yeah for me it seems the point changes were not thought about well enough. Certain upgrades to unit entries could have come down in price, like heath hunter upgrades, and as mentioned by funkyfellow wild huntsmen kindred should not have increased in favour of the elk receiving a larger increase. Core still seems taxed even if it is quality core and there is still no incentive to go past 1125 points. I'm surprised some things got cheaper but really all changes are too small to really make any dif…

  • Also in 5 more years additional forest eagles will be 5 points!

  • Well it is heading in the right direction. Maybe in a couple of more iterations we should see proper pricing on certain units. So how many of these changes each year? I estimate 5 more years until certain units get used, however by then the other units might make SE too high a tier and then even in after 5 years there might not be good costing anyway, so I probably predict that some units should just stay on the shelves indefinitely. On the positive I love how our magic item section became usabl…

  • Also simple trolls as well have become invalid. The skaven tunnel team also. I'm sure there are more but these two are the only two that come to mind right now. There are a couple of disputed cases such as with the change chariot which does not really fit as a hope harvester and it has gone down from 4 to 2 in the list. So DL has a couple of cases more like that I'm sure.

  • Yes mills are what they are just like cannons are what they are. They scare the crap out of things. However mills are really combat pieces in the army more then shooting pieces and I hope they remain a viable cc choice in the army. They should be pointed exactly like every other combat choice in the game. However they are better then all shooting options in our army.

  • Quote from Hachiman Taro: “ Maybe Heath Riders (but not Heath Hunters) drop a little. ” Why should heath riders not drop in points? Above in some post it was stated that they are used primarily to score objectives and hunters can't really do that. Do they appear in any lists?

  • - Yes I agree here with @CariadocThorne on his comments. I would like to expand on why. Core units could do with a bit of a reduction in price as they should be the backbone of the army and going over 1125 unlike current 900 point armies should not feel like such a gimp. However dryads are still a solid choice in the book. Some special choices feel lack luster as well. I would like to see more tough choices when picking units from here. SE do have ld issues and this could be addressed by lowerin…

  • It is also because I have 18 painted....

  • Quote from Wesser: “Quote from Bogi: “Apart from that there is nothing that has been used consistently in top performing lists? ” Thicket Beasts and Shepherds being spammed? ” Well not as much as they should be, wdg potent and ID kind of counters them but not that much actually and they are still tough enough even then. My current VS list really struggles here even with multiwound weapons available. I would call them a strong choice in our book. Top etc lists spammed them as well. Valentino chos…

  • As to the point changes above... I'm not really sure. On first glance they look OK, maybe not the wild hunter kindred. Not sure why all kindred upgrades as so expensive. Dryads are a bit cheap compared to other infantry choices however I feel all infantry choices need to be a bit cheaper and more. All core infantry in all books has been relegeted to one role and that is scoring, with no secondary like in the old days they would have no role at all. Does the inclusion secondary objective fill in …

  • I think someone needs to bite the bullet and just spend 5-10 mins doing the rules changes that SE need, especially in the enchantments department. Without this no price changes will fix them.

  • ETC lists

    Bogi - - The Vermin Swarm (VS)

    Post

    Quote: “High performing armies gets more and bigger points increases on their over-used entries, and fewer and smaller points decreases on their under-used entries. ” This means that VS underused entries are probably not going to become competitive? Even worse are UD underused entries where they need probably the biggest price hike of all the books. Why does usage even determine the price? Just because you need to use a bsb to stay competitive does not mean he needs to go up in price. This examp…

  • Well my gut feeling ofcourse! No jokes. Maybe as I said working towards a formulae can also help. I guess you convinced me that there is use in doing statistical analysis, ofc there is, not sure what I was saying. When people use the top 10 teams approach it is like saying use the gut feeling of the top 10 teams. However looking at current point cost of certain units in certain books, is the imbalance not obvious?

  • Quote from arwaker: “Is DE below par? ” Oh very much so yes they are. Speaking of statistics.... well I'm not sure about it. As a mathematician I have not had much contact with statistics apart from some stochastic differential equations and when I was studying quantum physics which does have a lot of probability distributions. Still I know a little bit about various tools used... But at the same time I definitely don't trust them and do not trust a statistical approach to balancing this game. I…