Duke Niemar's Homebrew Equitaine

    This site uses cookies. By continuing to browse this site, you are agreeing to our Cookie Policy.

    The latest issue of the 9th Scroll is here! You can read all about it in the news.

    Our beta phase is finally over. Download The Ninth Age: Fantasy Battles, 2nd Edition now!

    • Duke Niemar's Homebrew Equitaine

      Hear ye, hear ye!

      Once again I bid all thee brave knights, damsels and peasants a grandest of welcomes!

      I, Duke Niemar, has once and for all grown tired of the rules and regulations on our army enlistment put forward by the court of Equitaine. The Knights of Snowfall's Eves have today begun the ascent away from the rigorous limitations of lesser nobles and I will thus share our work with any and all interested parties. May the might of Equitaine be greater than that of the squabbling bureaucrats!

      We have also recovered plenty of magical artifacts once thought lost to the dominion of time, printed tactical guides for all our knights, enlisted able men to standing armies and finally built regimental stables for our most glorious of battle beasts!

      Without further rhetoric and ado, I give you:

      The Homebrew

      Yours sincerely

      Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves

      Disclaimer:

      Display Spoiler
      For those who have yet to realize: THIS IS A HOMEBREW. IT IS NOT OFFICIAL. THIS IS CREATED FOR PERSONAL USE ONLY.

      @Kapten Kluns Here you go! All point costs are not yet finalized. Some work may still be needed to clear up any grammar and spelling mistakes, in addition to trying to make the rules clearer and more transparent.

      Extra kudos to @echoctrl for providing me with a template to save time on formatting, as well as giving great inspiration from His homebrew. :thumbup: Thanks to the KoE community for being one of great devotion and vocal power to our army. Without your bickering and discussing, few of these ideas would had come to fruition in their current state! <3

      I am off to finally enjoy my army the way I always wanted! For the Lady!
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves

      The post was edited 11 times, last by Duke Niemar: Always with the grammar... And the changelog. ().

    • ... Now I feel pressured to release "my" version of KoE ASAP. It seems we had quite a few similar ideas!

      Anyway, some thoughts I had while reading it:
      - Banner of the Last Charge: This is insanely strong. Even at 100 points I would consider it borderline op.
      - Hippogriff knights are too strong with R5
    • Caledoriv wrote:

      ... Now I feel pressured to release "my" version of KoE ASAP. It seems we had quite a few similar ideas!

      Anyway, some thoughts I had while reading it:
      - Banner of the Last Charge: This is insanely strong. Even at 100 points I would consider it borderline op.
      - Hippogriff knights are too strong with R5
      Explain why you would consider it OP. I compare it in my meta where fleeing with a unit is somewhat situational. Mostly done by lone mages who have lost their bunker already.

      Are Hippoknights too strong AT R5 or just FOR their current points?
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Duke Niemar ().

    • echoctrl wrote:

      I feel very honored by how much of my stuff stayed in. You made wonderful use of everything. Keep it up.
      Plenty of your ideas were similar to my first draft, some minor differences. Keeping some of it intact was obvious. 2 wounds for GKs and the Not-peasant-conscripts-category for example.
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves
    • i went through it quickly due to time and mainly looking for how you modified existing units and some other things. I LOVE the changes to our current knights, especially Peg Knights, which include Jousting, the formations, the blessing, and in particular the oaths because a Grail character is BADASSS! I like the virtues, i like some of the magic items, not too crazy about others.

      It would be one expensive book but i'd prefer it despite that.

      Infantry, i still don't think we need more than what we have, just different rules that make them require knights to function at 100%

      The black knight is sweet!
    • Duke Niemar wrote:

      Explain why you would consider it OP. I compare it in my meta where fleeing with a unit is somewhat situational. Mostly done by lone mages who have lost their bunker already.

      Are Hippoknights too strong AT R5 or just FOR their current points?
      I just think they are too strong as a game concept. Independently from any point costs. The ability to fly means they cannot be redirected, with T5, 3+ Armour and Blessing they are quite resilient and their damage output is also quite high.
      They have no downside whatsoever.

      They are superior to any other flying unit in the game: Flying monsters have much less offensive capabilities and mostly also comparable defensive capabilities. Yet, they are more susceptible to cannons and don't have ward saves.
      Characters on flying mounts are also comparable to them; but these can be shut down with Duels. The Hippogriff Knight unit is also immune to this.

      Tl;DR: Hippo Knights are too good at everything with T5. They need at least one downside.
    • Caledoriv wrote:

      Duke Niemar wrote:

      Explain why you would consider it OP. I compare it in my meta where fleeing with a unit is somewhat situational. Mostly done by lone mages who have lost their bunker already.

      Are Hippoknights too strong AT R5 or just FOR their current points?
      I just think they are too strong as a game concept. Independently from any point costs. The ability to fly means they cannot be redirected, with T5, 3+ Armour and Blessing they are quite resilient and their damage output is also quite high.They have no downside whatsoever.

      They are superior to any other flying unit in the game: Flying monsters have much less offensive capabilities and mostly also comparable defensive capabilities. Yet, they are more susceptible to cannons and don't have ward saves.
      Characters on flying mounts are also comparable to them; but these can be shut down with Duels. The Hippogriff Knight unit is also immune to this.

      Tl;DR: Hippo Knights are too good at everything with T5. They need at least one downside.
      Alright, I see your point. But I was reluctant to create different breeds of mounts. It creates unnecessary confusion if it cannot be structured better.

      As a weakness, being slow might be one such. Having lower march rate would mean they cannot jump on flanks as easy and cannot get across redirectors with such little effort. It would make it easier escaping them and leaving them stranded without a good target.

      Otherwise I would feel inclined to drop the R on the character hippo as well for the sake of simplicity.
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves

      The post was edited 2 times, last by Duke Niemar ().

    • There are several issues I have with less speed:
      - it goes directly against the ASAW
      - As long as it is flying, it doesn't really matter. If I canot hop behind the redirector, I park directly before it. I still got closer without giving my opponent a chance to charge me

      Flying is much too versatile on units with strong offensive capabilities. Just think of VC vampire spawns or even Morghasts... Morghasts are limited in number, have less armour and no ward. And are slower.

      In my opinion, an even more powerful flying unit is not what the game needs.
    • Yes, in your opinion. That is all we can relate to here in saying what an army or game need or doesn't need.

      I do believe such a unit would be needed in order to bring some much needed power and sustain to our army. EVERYTHING can be balanced with points cost as long as it isn't immortal. I would argue that a unit of WDG monstrous cavalry would be equally strong depending on price, they have roughly equal damage output, survivability and movement. But nobody blames them for being OP, only that they are tough model for model. Let the hippoknights cost more for their added ability to fly. Having a 1000 point unit at 12 wounds is risky, even with a R5, 6/5+ aegis and some armor.
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves
    • Let me ask you some questions then:

      Duke Niemar wrote:

      I do believe such a unit would be needed in order to bring some much needed power and sustain to our army.
      Then why does it have to be flying? A unit that is good at grinding doesn't need to be flying.

      Why does it have to have T5? Even Chosen Knights haven only T4. With T4, they'd still be among the toughest flying units out there :) .

      To summarise: Why do you want the Hippogryph knights to be both the tankiest unit AND the most "grindy" unit at once?
    • Caledoriv wrote:

      Let me ask you some questions then:

      Duke Niemar wrote:

      I do believe such a unit would be needed in order to bring some much needed power and sustain to our army.
      Then why does it have to be flying? A unit that is good at grinding doesn't need to be flying.
      Why does it have to have T5? Even Chosen Knights haven only T4. With T4, they'd still be among the toughest flying units out there :) .

      To summarise: Why do you want the Hippogryph knights to be both the tankiest unit AND the most "grindy" unit at once?
      Primarily for the sake of streamlining. Maybe I am just damaged after seeing grail dukes without divine attacks and pegasus mounts with 1" less movement than the unit.

      How would you solve it practically? I know it might be seen as a unit that is master of all trades, but I cannot come to terms with how to design the unit to be able to fulfill their role without being oddly different from other similar entries in the same book.

      Rename the character mount to Royal Hippogryph? Rename the unit ones to Young Hippogryphs? One use only fly movement for the unit ones? Ideas are welcome.
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves
    • Well, in my home brew KoE Version I made it a single model unit. It is very similar to monsters from other races like this.
      The grinding unit part was given to two new units, namely a new 1+ save cavalry unit and a new non-flying monstrous infantry unit.

      If it has to be hippogriff knights as a unit with more than one model, then you named possible solutions already:
      - Young Griffons with only T4. Yes, they'd be very similar to Pegasus Knights this way. But way less Rock-Paper-Scissors. Maybe it is possible to differentiate both units enough... Although I still feel they'd be too powerful if they kept their speed.
      - Make the Hippogriff Mount for the Duke stronger: 5 HP, Stomp (D3), 5A, WS 5.... There are a number of possibilities to differentiate it.
      - Make the Young Griffons Weaker: Only 2 Attacks, only AP 2

      I actually like the idea of a one-use only fly movement. If it is restricted to units that are not charging that is. It doesn't break the Speed concept of the KoE army :) .
      The only thing I see here is a fluff explanation: Why can they only fly once? It's possibly that they are too young and too easily exhausted... But why don't KoE knights wait until they're a little bit older then?
    • Diablo_DF wrote:

      Another home-brew. Oh well, here I go..[will edit in comments later].

      Btw, how good do you guys think our chances would be to actually make a KoE community book out of the best ideas of all homebrews. Set up a thread in homebrew, make some polls...? Obvious problem being that everyone likes their own ideas the best..:)
      Gee thanks for the enthusiasm. Way to stick a broadsword in the old confidence.

      Some things are pretty much consistent through all the homebrews. Cavalry is epic and characters likewise. Infantry is weaker. I for one would ofcourse be very proud if any of my ideas get through to something final, but I would be even happier if the official guys at T9A does something at all from either of the currently released homebrews.
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves
    • Caledoriv wrote:

      Well, in my home brew KoE Version I made it a single model unit. It is very similar to monsters from other races like this.
      The grinding unit part was given to two new units, namely a new 1+ save cavalry unit and a new non-flying monstrous infantry unit.

      If it has to be hippogriff knights as a unit with more than one model, then you named possible solutions already:
      - Young Griffons with only T4. Yes, they'd be very similar to Pegasus Knights this way. But way less Rock-Paper-Scissors. Maybe it is possible to differentiate both units enough... Although I still feel they'd be too powerful if they kept their speed.
      - Make the Hippogriff Mount for the Duke stronger: 5 HP, Stomp (D3), 5A, WS 5.... There are a number of possibilities to differentiate it.
      - Make the Young Griffons Weaker: Only 2 Attacks, only AP 2

      I actually like the idea of a one-use only fly movement. If it is restricted to units that are not charging that is. It doesn't break the Speed concept of the KoE army :) .
      The only thing I see here is a fluff explanation: Why can they only fly once? It's possibly that they are too young and too easily exhausted... But why don't KoE knights wait until they're a little bit older then?
      Exactly, there is afterall a realistic approach to be considered. Why would they bring a weak griffon to battle and risk it dying before being fully trained? Education might lack in Equitaine, but seriously...
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves
    • echoctrl wrote:

      My solution to the Hippogriff, is a 4+ AS and no Ward Save against Shooting. This may run the opposite problem. So, keep at it and work towards the middle.
      I have made some changes to the hippogryphs. Points costs are not yet adjusted.
      "In the end rules are just the groundwork for 2 players to have an agreement on how the game is played. If you friends/gaming group is fine with it you can do what ever you want with the game." - Smart Guy on the T9A forum

      "By the Lady, is that Elderberries I smell?" - Duke Niemar of Snowfall's Eves