Comunity feedback on DL and WDG update

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  • I would do these changes:
    1. Max unit size 5
    2. Reduce wounds to 3 = at most 30 toxic attacks and not 48
    3. Toxic does not work vs special attacks like impact grinding etc.


    This makes them also managabale in close combat with distinct counter like impact hits or grinding attacks

                    

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  • @Klexe,

    Thanks for the numbers. In WTC list they are already many list with 2 Bloat flies units. We gonna see a lot of this..coz they can easily mess up a KoE or WDG army. So in that sense they are very good for team tournaments.

    Personally I only play team tournament and it piss me off when my army gets another red in the spreadsheet for a unit that isnt properly balanced.

    I Will try to get a paladin with the forlons wearing the Crown of wizard and my Master Wizzard with Essence of free mind. Is a patch to counter the flies...and see how it goes..but to do that need to remove something else from a well performing list. What can I say..dunno how this unit went through balance if eveyrone knew how strong they are versus [lexicon]KoE

    The post was edited 2 times, last by SirVelinn ().

  • They mess up with almost anything with decent armor and even without armor...

    I am really happy they are so strong. Perhaps more people complain about toxic then.

    For example these guys charging saurus warriors with spears and flaming

    Spears hit first = 25 av =8wounds
    5.3 dead saurus
    4 back = 3 dead
    2 stomps
    Flies have 1+3+2+5.3=11.3
    Saurus have 4+8=12
    Jesus...what? You run into a fat block of one of the strongest infantry counter

    (they are the strongest imo as flies have Dws 2 and thus enables saurus to hit on 3+ reroll 1)


    Alpha carno? Hell he dies most likely too. Deal 18 wounds and he is dead on avg which is not hard with d3 dmg Ows 4 reroll 1....

    Yes they have salamander but dl has many counter against these too with s5 shooting and spammable magic spears.

    Skins with parry and stuff well flies don't care with Ows 3 and every wound they get give 1.33 more dead skinks....


    Really is there ANY melee unit who can beat them?

    Doesn't matter which Agility lol....

    Hbe spears? With flaming?
    4.6
    4.6 spears dead
    7 from fighting... Lul

                    

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  • I can only think of melee unit with 4++ Wardsave. Dancers and flamewardens.

    Also any list with a lot of magic dmg. A HE list with divi and 3 boltthrowers..or ID list with lore of fire and same goes for EoS

    I think the solution is pretty simple. For starters just bring down the toxic attack to 1 hit instead of 2. Then leave the rest for some a couple of month and see how it goes...
  • Kapten Kluns wrote:

    I made a suggestion about toxic blood not generating CR and that they hit after combat but before crumble.
    Could create a solid weakness for flies from either units with mass enough to win combat against them to force crumble. Or units strong enough to just erase them before toxic hits.
    Well this would help if they are like 3 models with 3 wounds. But the idea is decent. But at 24 wounds it is almost impossible to erase them before crumble.

    I wouldnt reduce the number of toxic though as this is the idea behind them.

    I would overall change toxic to s2

                    

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  • Klexe wrote:

    Kapten Kluns wrote:

    I made a suggestion about toxic blood not generating CR and that they hit after combat but before crumble.
    Could create a solid weakness for flies from either units with mass enough to win combat against them to force crumble. Or units strong enough to just erase them before toxic hits.
    Well this would help if they are like 3 models with 3 wounds. But the idea is decent. But at 24 wounds it is almost impossible to erase them before crumble.
    I wouldnt reduce the number of toxic though as this is the idea behind them.

    I would overall change toxic to s2
    Yeah but shooting and casting magic at them would prove more important and flies charging elite infantry which imo is the largest of the problems so far would imo be solved or atleast involve more skill required from the DL player.
    Flank and rear charges would also prove more rewarding as a tool to eat away at their healthpool.

    So limiting them to 1 manifestation and the timing of acid blood feels apropriate.
    S2 feels a little so and so for me. It only makes them worse without requiring more skill to play with or against.
  • Marcos24 wrote:

    The idea that designs are influenced more for team tournaments where you can aim your preferred matchups rather than singles where the priority is all comers lists really irritates me
    I don't think it is like that. They were made for a specific target, armored units. That make them valuable in any setting but more of a gamble in singles and all comers if you don't meet your intended target, almost like alchemy. Many units are made like these (catapults against infantry, sylvan sentinels against high r units), to counter something and in a team environment you can then spam that because of matching.

    I understand from the conversation here that this unit is beyond this but I hope you understand what I'm getting at.