ID: public playtesting comments

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    • @MPS I´ve read it before, but I thought that you can´t stomp due to the specific sentence in the attack. ARe you sure at 100% that the note has prevalence against the attack? why the sentence specifies clearly that the giant cant do any other attack?

      MAybe we´ll need a third oppinion

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Kaneador ().

    • Kaneador wrote:

      @MPS I´ve read it before, but I thought that you can´t stomp due to the specific sentence in the attack. ARe you sure at 100% that the note has prevalence against the attack? why the sentence specifies clearly that the giant cant do any other attack?

      MAybe we´ll need a third oppinion
      Read the giant rules again. It says on the bottom "After using this chart, the giant can still stomp as normal"

      I don't think it gets any more clear than that.
    • Ferkinason wrote:

      I played them a lot too in the last month and thou I would not bring them to a bigger tournament I like the tools they bring.

      They can reliable block like chaff because of their high LD, stubborn and six wounds.
      They bring rather cheap and mobile terror tests.
      They are pretty resiliant versus small arms fire and fire magic. And funny enough fire magic is still a common thing.

      And many players won't let them near many of their units cause they can't predict what the giant does.

      That being said I sadly never liked the randomness of giants... :-/


      Edit
      The giants definetely get their stomps even if they bellowed this round. Reading the rules part after the giant attacks.
      Lagerlof stated otherwise a while ago:


      Lagerlof wrote:

      bargo wrote:

      Lagerlof wrote:

      Nirnel wrote:

      Kisscool wrote:

      Giant attacks :


      1: Bellow
      Bellow: Neither the Giant nor the chosen unit can make any further Close Combat attacks this phase. Attacks
      already resolved (including attacks resolved simultaneously with this attack) are not affected. The Giant's side
      automatically wins the combat by 2. If two (or more) opposing Giants “Bellow”, the combat is a draw.

      NotesGiant
      Attacks are Close Combat attacks and are therefore affected by all rules normally affecting Close Combat
      attacks. After rolling on this chart, the Giant may still Stomp as normal.
      After rolling Bellow, the giant may Stomp or not ?
      Normally, a "can not" overrides a "may". The "may" is optional; the "can not" isn't. I don't remember whether I saw this rule in 9th Age BRB, though.
      Yeah, RAW is defenitely he can't stomp after bellowing, which makes sense, since the enemy wouldnt be allowed to do it either (if possible)
      We have a can not do close combat vs a must and may stomp as special close combat. does the can not and must cancel out leaving a may???
      Stomp (X) Special Attack
      A model with this special rule must make a Special Close Combat Attack in the Close Combat Phase
      The "must attack" applies to all forms of close combat attacks, so nothing wierd about that, Bellow takes priority, so no attacks of any kind.

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    • I really dont see how "Neither the giant or the chosen unit can make any further attacks" can be read as he can stomp? What would be the point of even including the giant in the phrase if he was allowed to stomp?
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    • Kaneador wrote:

      Lagerlof wrote:

      I really dont see how "Neither the giant or the chosen unit can make any further attacks" can be read as he can stomp? What would be the point of even including the giant in the phrase if he was allowed to stomp?
      @Largerlof I understard that your answer is official becouse you are a memer of the rules team? thanks
      I'm not Rules Team, but my answers are official. If I'm not sure I ask RT before I give an answer. I don't see a need for that in this case, the rules are very clear IMO.
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    • I've played arround 10 games with my new list: Those are my conclusions

      BB really doesn´t work in big units with 30 bbs with banner of speed I was able to kill 15 skelentons in a round of shooting and 5 (or 4?) Phoenix guardians. The point is that they shoot between 1 and 0 per battle. hob with archers are better to clear chaff by far and cheaper and etc. On the other hand 10 bb units Works fine. If you can fix this wearpon a) give spears to bb as an option to increase his cc potencial and b) the Wall of lead mode must be devastating in 'theoretical 9th' becouse it would be used between 1 and 0 maybe S5 with multiple shoots ranks -3 (5 wounds in a T4 AS4+, 8 wounds in a T3 AS5+ with 30 bb, 3,7 wounds in a T4AS4+, 5,56 wounds in a T3 AS5+ with 20 bb ) kick to fire or the easiest way increase the range to 18" kick to fire multiple shoots ranks -3 and a Wall of lead mode in ss. BUT Wall of lead mode must work in ss (we are talking about kill 12 necropolis guard or 16 goblins/humans with 1 round of shooting + ss with a unit of +/-750 ponit cost)in order to be used at least once per battle.

      Giants Works fine against monsters but Yell and brawl mode against troops is oldfashioned since they are stubborn 90% of times and you can't stomp. they really need an upgrade of 3+ AS to be competitive

      slaves,incarnates, inmortals,hobs in wolves, hbo hero in wolf and boltthrowers are awesome.

      rocket launchers and titan mortar are so expensive and you cant trust on them since they are impacting on 5+ they have potential but his attacks are random. you`ll impact twice in a battle and 1 misfire ( assuming that your catapults are ignored by your enemy and that you can choose a suitable objective all the rounds) and S7 against monsters means that you 'll hit at 3+. For the Price you pay they really need to impact on 4+ but if you use an ingenieer you loose a magician (you must choose fire becouse of the range, and if you are unlucky most of your spells just do´nt have range) and a unit becouse our ID lack of ranged weapons. so you must invest arround 1000 in a mortar with hp4

      Titan. the only scary part of the titan is his Price he really needs a 4+/4++ or a Price decrease

      Our ID characters remains a bit overcosted

      And the train with hammers remains overcosted too maybe 425- 440 points would be fine. I playtest shooty versión twice and I feel is well costed but doesn't addpt my way of make war.

      Cheers
    • MPS wrote:

      @Kaneador "Giants Works fine against monsters but Yell and brawl mode against troops is oldfashioned since they arestubborn 90% of times and you can't stomp. they really need an upgrade of 3+ AS to be competitive"

      We have discussed this before, you CAN stomp even after Yell and Brawl result. Giants are not that bad against infantery!
      No you can't.

      Unless you can show me someone from Rules Team saying anything else.
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    • So after arround 15 Games here a few comments of things I would like to change.

      1. Infernal Weapon for characters should go down a tinsy bit (30 for Lord, 20 for BSB, 10 for mage) for because cant be enchanted anymore).
      2. Taurukh Subjugator is a bit to expensive. Needs either T6 or an item like Tuktheks guards. Also rule of 3 or less Taurukhs Annointed to shoot him out like oger.
      3. Blunderbuss should be a cheap one time shooter. Currently is not practically.
      4. Immortals were really hard nerved (blezing works much less due to only half ap rounded up, Infernal Weapon two points). Maybe shield wall[/pexicon] would be good for them. Currently with 32 points with [lexicon]Infernal weapon, per Model to expensive. At least one point. Ground model too buy to weaker blessing also 1 point.
      5. Taurukh annointed need initiate defence 1 also equipment to expensive (15 for infernal weapon, 5 for shield or 10 would be only ok if they have initiate defence 1)
      6. Wolfriders: Should be core if 8 or more like so many others. Also this rule would be possible for Taurukhs. Wolfriders are no opportunists. Why?
      7. Kadim Titam: Way to expensive. To vulnerable to fireproof
      8. Rocket launcher: Still crappy and unplayable.
      9. Overlord should cost the same as a dwarf king. 50 points difference not justified.
      10. Gunneryteam: Granate launcher is to expensive.
      11. Citadel guard: Seem a bit to expensive. Maybe flintlocks 1p down.
      12. Bound kadim: Missing amour +1 to be great but maybe thats the exchance.
      13. Plz make Mask of furnace an amour item again. Artefact place is more valueable than amour.
      14. Hobgoblin chiefrain missing an hp. Suppossed to be like human. So switch attack for hp.
      15. Besheluks mechanism is not useable due to dominant. Only bound spell I know that is dominant.
      16. Prophet: Kind of strange that he cant have items for 150 points when not master. 40 points for heirloom (needed because you field only one mage), 15 points for something like alchemist allow.

      Also an adept mage item or an item that gives ability to choose spells from to lores (master becoming double adept of two lores but only channeling one of course. Still keeps +1 to cast or loosing this instead of cost). Adept becomes apprentice to two lores.

      Good stuff:

      1. Infernal engine: Seems a bit to cheap. Maybe more expensive but choice before game, what you want to use (steam hammers pr scrapnel gun). Definitive missing chosen of ashuruk due to crew.
      2. Banner of shamut: Superb for what it does. So maybe with 50 points to cheap.
      3. Infernal warriors seem super cheap now. 18 points for model with great weapon
      Please complain a little more that your army and only your army is to weak. Its not your play for sure ;)

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      The post was edited 3 times, last by Traumdieb ().

    • Might as well put some playtesting data down now that I have had some more 2.02 games under my belt.

      The Good:

      Flamethrowers are amazing. They do tons of damage and are hard to get rid of without magic or being SE.

      Incarnates are incredible blenders. The frenzy nerf barely affects them if you keep near your general Turn 2/3. Often you don't test anyway because they have jumped into combat and started combat.


      The bad:

      The multitude of nerfs to Immortals is painful.
      If my opponent ignored them they did nothing. But shooting and magic aimed at them just melts them. And being the 2nd most expensive infantry in the game is not worth this hassle.


      Anointed are awful.
      Their price is not worth a unit this incapable of doing anything decently. They are just meh. Meh offense, meh defense, meh speed.


      Taurukh are just not good to surviving anything other than a turn in combat if they charge. 2nd turn or got charged and they crumble fast even in big units.
      Darts or go home it seems :/.


      Rocket Battery. Killed stuff...just nowhere near its cost.


      Disciples. Fragility meant I lost the whole unit in 2 turns of shooting. Their offense was so bad that in combat they failed to kill pathfinders.