Musings about the Complaining on T9A Forums

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Comments 20

  • red_zebra_ve -

    Hi, I am Korben Dallas and I came here to "negotiate" about my favourite army.
    Hello, My name is Inigo Montoya, you destroyed my favourite army, prepare to die.

  • SkargitCrookfang -

    Oh gosh… OB… as a former College Instructor this hit me like a ton of bricks- I thought these public displays of ideology and harassment was only present where I taught. We dealt with everything from the religious to the socially ideological conveying thought and opinion in an harassing and, generally, bigoted manner. I have a whole theory on Trump regarding this, but that's for another time...

    But on the overall premise of your video- spot on. I’d add more, but I think someone else said it better than I:
    What is a cynic?
    “A man who knows the price of everything, and the value of nothing”.
    Thank you, Mr. Wilde.

    Great work as always, OB.

  • Pellegrim -

    First I thought "oh my, what is the message in this vid?". Then I watched it, and it is a really on point analysis / opinion about forum morale. I learned form it, and will even reread what I post from now on :) Cheers!

  • Stortotta -

    Great post man, I whole heartedly agree.

  • Legendary -

    All these changes from version to version have been good changes for the game but it also makes it seem like anything is possible for the next update. So as a player, you might as well argue or complain until you get your wish list. Hopefully, with 1.0 players will realize and expect only minor changes and will become more realistic. I think people know that the beta phase is only so long and it's almost over. Then the game will hopefully become more stable in terms of rules and points, etc. Without so many changes in between versions. Any large changes will just not be able to happen and small changes may be difficult. People want to yell and scream their ideas or complain to change things before this stability occurs. I am hoping that it's a bunch of preachers now in this example but once the game reaches some stability it will not be the case.

  • SmithF -

    Thanks for this video, @oncebitten360 !

    I agree with pretty much everything you said. So please continue your rambling :)

  • Mr.Gobbo -

    Really good video - nice with some food for thought!

    What's up with the camera bobbing about, though?

    • oncebitten360 -

      Oh, you noticed that? Ha ha. I had my laptop balanced on my knees as I was reclining in the rocking chair. It was hard for me to watch the video with all the bobbing about; it's better just to listen. :)

    • Mr.Gobbo -

      *it's better to just listen*

      - And that was exactly what I ended up doing :D
      Rocking chairs are da bomb. I have one too!

    • Scylla -

      Add a purring FX and it'll feel exactly as if you set a GoPro on your cat's head :)

      More seriously, I have little personal experience with real life preachers as it's not really (or no longer) a European thing, but the safety and anonymity provided by Internet nicknames is often used to vent off and eventually turn into a troll. Or as Penny Arcade would put elegantly it:

      If I can give you an advice as another heavy Internet user, the best thing you can do is armor yourself against these behaviors and skip such comments. Don't let the toxicity of some hurt yourself and lower your standards: what you're doing is worth it and supported by not only active users, but also a silent majority of thousands of wargamers who quietly benefit from T9A's balanced rules in their spare time and enjoy your videos.
      Please keep up the good work :)

  • shakedown47 -

    Well said. We may just have to sticky this in the WDG forum!

    Frankly, I believe a lot of it comes down to jealousy on some basic level; pride of authorship, and the drive to have your own ideas recognized and praised. Precisely because this is a community-driven effort, the time exists as it never has before for any random individual to directly influence the rules and gameplay of a fantasy mass wargame. Innovative or well-thought-out ideas that are presented on the forums are discussed and considered even if they didn't come from an actual team member; a lot of the serial complainers are really just people who want their voices to be heard and to be recognized for what they perceive to be superior game design.

    BUT there is a bright side to all the complaining, which is that it's both a clear indicator that people truly care about this game AND that they recognize it as the most viable successor to the hobby after the death of WFB. People complain because they actually plan on playing this game. Because the project is held in high enough esteem to warrant their complaints. Because, for all their annoying whining and moaning, they'd rather be a part of this community than not.

    That said, some people really are just the fire and brimstone troglodyte in the quad: knowing full well that they won't make a bit of difference, but content with the idea that if it all does come burning down they can stand ready with a well-rehearsed "I told you so." I know I can think of a couple.

  • Shlagrabak -

    "What if we just took the attitude of: our book is what it is, so what can we do about this book that would be effective", I agree very much on this. When it was GW delivering some rules, they were much more imbalanced and yet people spent more time trying to create strong lists and less time complaining. This is actually the best way of demonstrating that something is not at the right power level/have a bad design, regarding contributions. I guess people didn't do it as much when they felt rules writers were out of reach.

  • Digger -

    "it's all about negotiation" i think that's the core of it really. a spoiled kid will not accept having to negotiate with the mommy untill it gets educated in some form or another. And some people who believe they already have an answer tend to stop listening.

    that preacher sounds awesome though, i wish i could meet him.

    It would be nice though if that preacher would be open for a calm socratic discussion, but i doubt his ears will be open. Did anyone actually tell him yet he's being too... noisy?

    • Warboss Tooth -

      We get a lot of those "preachers" in Chicago, on the train, bus, outside big food establishments and on busy streets. Sometimes they even bring a portable microphone and speaker. If anyone ever mentions they are a nuisances they will blurt out loudly "THIS IS THE DEVIL IN THE FLESH TRYING TO SILENCE GODS WORD!!"

    • An Empire Fallen Studio -

      @Warboss Tooth, You also get a lot of ambulances :P

  • There Is No Spoon -

    Very reasonable philosophy, but remember you are seeing the issues from the inside. That means you are more involved, have greater awareness of events, and feel more influential in the community driven game. I'm very critical (in the classical sense of the word), but sometimes I'm flat out wrong because I'm less informed about what's going on behind the scenes.

  • Warboss Tooth -

    everything is so broken! but my army is the only one that got nerfed....

    • oncebitten360 -

      Oh, you've heard that one, too, huh?

    • SkargitCrookfang -

      It's funny... I was expecting that reaction in v0.99... but yet again, the DL forum surprises me and gives me reason to believe in humanity. The reactions were, generally "Yeah, we deserved to get nerfed. We were way OP...maybe we were whacked a litte bit hard...but it's understandable. Lets all discuss in a mature manner!".

      Logic and respect on the internet are rare flowers that are to be nurtured.