Avras Homebrew Thread

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    • Avras Homebrew Thread

      After a few days' hard work, I have released a full formal homebrew auxiliary army list for Avras. Fluff and Enchanted Items included. The army is built to suffer from discipline issues and poor coordination between its living and undead elements. It relies upon well-equipped infantry and cavalry, undead auxiliaries, and naptha to bring victory. This builds upon my earlier thread exploring adding various auxiliary armies to cover various parts of Vetia not adequately represented in existing armies.
    • why undead units?
      and I still believe; Light infantry should fight and shoot in 3 ranks, FREE command groups for EoS units. Imperial Guards should have weaponmaster and both parent and support, and that halbardiers should wear heavy armor. Brace for impact should be changed to, or there should be an extra order: " Have at THEM!" The unit gain battle focus.
      For Sunna and the Emperor!!
    • Tec43 wrote:

      Some nice ideas here, although I'm personally not bothered by any of the weapons enchantments which I'm not a fan of.

      Also if youre using the huskarl rules for the 'varangians' would it not be a good idea to make them 20mm so if you put a 20mm strategos in them it doesnt mess up the unit footprint?
      But then WoTG players would have to rebase their vikings to use for Avras. It's easier (and cooler) if we just let the player use a mounted commander in the unit.
      As for the magic items, its my best shot at trying to be unique and interesting without being overpowered. Romans (including Eastern Romans) were all about discipline and tactics (even if treachery was a big issue), and the magic items emphasize this. Just think about it: we even have a magic item that simulates decimation!

      Tec43 wrote:

      Also it could work to include the makhar compound bow in this book? Give at least some of the archer units something interesting rather than just being 'humans with bows'.
      I'd rather not make Avrasian archery any stronger than it already is now. These are not wood elves, after all. Avras, as I have interpreted it, isn't about archery anyway; its about the interplay between your commanders and your core units.

      Smythen wrote:

      why undead units?
      Because official fluff has it that General Fontaine consorts with vampires (especially his vampiric lover, who is probably a Lamia). It is canon that a force of Avrasian undead comprised of ghosts and zombies all-but-destroyed an Equitanian task force sent to overthrow the general.
    • Fair points,

      Bit concerned by the sunblessed point. On foot you'll be str6 and mounted str7/8 but how many units have disc6 or lower? So the Spear is surely wounding most things on 6s/5s and the occasional thing on 4s/3s/2s and on horseback it's not much better.


      Edit: Unless there's loads of sub 6 discipline units in which case spear might be okay in some matchups, just it being so bad against disc 8 when as a Spear makes the cost seem steep for the Spear

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Tec43 ().

    • Tec43 wrote:

      Fair points,

      Bit concerned by the sunblessed point. On foot you'll be str6 and mounted str7/8 but how many units have disc6 or lower? So the Spear is surely wounding most things on 6s/5s and the occasional thing on 4s/3s/2s and on horseback it's not much better.


      Edit: Unless there's loads of sub 6 discipline units in which case spear might be okay in some matchups, just it being so bad against disc 8 when as a Spear makes the cost seem steep for the Spear
      Next draft will specify unmodified discipline. That way, it can be a threat to low-disc tarpits.
    • I very dislike the byzantynian names. Avras is not only Costantinopoli. Is a city that is the center of the world since 4000 year. The biggest city of the world. On the fluff is written that is a multicultural (and multiracial) city.
      The key of the book is on the right way and this is a very good starting point. So good job @JestingKnight . I think the road to the last goal is going to be long. So godspeed my friend.
    • Mercenary Armies wrote:

      I very dislike the byzantynian names. Avras is not only Costantinopoli. Is a city that is the center of the world since 4000 year. The biggest city of the world. On the fluff is written that is a multicultural (and multiracial) city.
      The key of the book is on the right way and this is a very good starting point. So good job @JestingKnight . I think the road to the last goal is going to be long. So godspeed my friend.
      The multiracial thing is very hard to design. If I add dwarvish and elvish units, Avras might become a bit too powerful. Instead, I like to imagine that Avras has a racially integrated army (like Rome) and that some units are more or less elvish or dwarvish than others. The Cthonian watch probably have a number of dwarves alongside humans. The cataphracts and sagitarii probably have more elves than usual. But a Roman-style racially integrated army means these cannot be reflected in stats.

      Next version, I will try adding Reaver Chariots (anyone else here played Quadriga?), Sea Guard, Greybeards, and Deep Watch to Avras' Finest as a compromise of sorts. Elves will naturally be frequent sights among chariot racers and elite marines. Dwarves are recruited specially to the Palatine forces, with some being placed at the disposal of the Cthonian Watch.

      As for the byzantian names, it's there mostly to reflect a declining empire on the verge of collapse, as Late Medieval Byzantium was and Avras canonically is, and with Vermin and Chaos playing the role of the Ottomans.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by JestingKnight ().

    • Ghiznuk wrote:

      Loving this list so far.

      But as @Mercenary Armies said, if you keep all those unit names in Greek, then I go translate the Koghi AB in Malian :)
      Isn't that right, @Calisson ? :D
      You're leaving out the Latin names :P (Dux, Limitanei, Comitatenses, Palatines, Sagittarii)

      I use a good English equivalent where one exists (cataphracts instead of kataphractoi, for example). But the Limitanei are not militia and calling them "levy infantry" confounds the fact that most Comitatenses are levied too. Comitatenses are legionnaires, but so are limitanei and palatines. I could call the Palatines Praetorians, but they encompass more than just the palace guard, despite their name. The term Despot is an english word, and the double entendre with the Greek captures the relationship between vampire aristocrats and the public. The Latin term Dux is a formal title of late Roman nobility, and is better than Duke, Aristocrat, or Courtier for the purpose. The only place where I am indulging myself shamelessly is in the use of the term "Sagittarii" when "Ranged Auxiliaries" would work just fine. My excuse there is that it sounds way cooler than "Ranged Auxiliaries," just like how "Huskarl" sounds better than "Housecarl" sounds better than "Household Infantry" as far as the Asklanders are concerned.

      If you want my advice on Koghi, go straight ahead and use a smattering a Malian words for flavor, just as long as you make sure their meaning is contextually clear.
    • My two cents
      The roman style/ byzantinian style is not in line with the official bg in my opinion.
      I'll try to explane why.

      Point 1
      About Avras in 962 a.S.
      We know that is big. That is awesome. That is dangerous. A lot (a lot!)of district. Volskayan district is the one where a traveller died.
      General Fontaine is the ruler from equitaine. His army has to be a kind of western army more similar to crusader than Byzantine age of empire style.

      Maybe the city doesn't know about the undead army. We know that they fought a battle Equitaine against Undead. near the city, but was near swamps and stuffes, so the people of Avras maybe still don't know.
      What do you think guys?
      Point 2
      Avras army concerns only the city?
      We don't know if. General Fontaine rule over some lands, like a kingdom. how big is it the kingdom of Avras?
      To go forward we have to know this point.
      In my mind I see Avras with some bannerman castle on the west side. Maybe the kingdom touch Myra.. What do you think?
      Point 3
      We have to remember that the history of ratfree Avras starts 962 years ago. Sunna was buried there and she become an icon of the city (I think is important for cult and stuff, maybe you can use this idea).
      The city is proud about the victory against the rats army. Where is that pride here? ;)
      I think that after ony 962 years of history, for most part still unknowed, we know that the city was ruled by equitaine for a while and now is ruled by a mad caotic (I wish) and a mistress vampire lady is not logic to think that this army has to have a byzantynian flavour.

      Remember that I love you guys. Don't let Vanadra get in. Sunna bless you all.

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Mercenary Armies ().

    • Mercenary Armies wrote:

      If it was a wish list...i have this wet dream: all the popoulation of Avras (millions) was turned in to undead....

      ...ah...a man can dream.
      Lol u a Dominions 5 player by any chance? Because there is exactly this sort of faction there.

      Mercenary Armies wrote:

      My two cents
      The roman style/ byzantinian style is not in line with the official bg in my opinion.
      I'll try to explane why.

      Point 1
      About Avras in 962 a.S.
      We know that is big. That is awesome. That is dangerous. A lot (a lot!)of district. Volskayan district is the one where a traveller died.
      General Fontaine is the ruler from equitaine. His army has to be a kind of western army more similar to crusader than Byzantine age of empire style.

      Maybe the city doesn't know about the undead army. We know that they fought a battle Equitaine against Undead. near the city, but was near swamps and stuffes, so the people of Avras maybe still don't know.
      What do you think guys?
      Point 2
      Avras army concerns only the city?
      We don't know if. General Fontaine rule over some lands, like a kingdom. how big is it the kingdom of Avras?
      To go forward we have to know this point.
      In my mind I see Avras with some bannerman castle on the west side. Maybe the kingdom touch Myra.. What do you think?
      Point 3
      We have to remember that the history of ratfree Avras starts 962 years ago. Sunna was buried there and she become an icon of the city (I think is important for cult and stuff, maybe you can use this idea).
      The city is proud about the victory against the rats army. Where is that pride here? ;)
      I think that after ony 962 years of history, for most part still unknowed, we know that the city was ruled by equitaine for a while and now is ruled by a mad caotic (I wish) and a mistress vampire lady is not logic to think that this army has to have a byzantynian flavour.

      Remember that I love you guys. Don't let Vanadra get in. Sunna bless you all.

      Fontaine has only the knights he brought with him. They are likely scattered across the army as officers by this point. He simply does not have enough to hold Avras, else he would not have resorted to using undead. So a few knights have been integrated into the local cavalry, a few are probably converted to vampirism by now, and the rest are likely officers on horse and foot alike. Remember that these knights will not be replaced except by their (probably assimilated into Avrasian culture) children.

      As for the undead, Avras has had vampires living in the city for several hundred years among the nobility. That is plenty of time to spread their taint, and plenty of time to be detected. The obvious reason that they are still around is that it is too much trouble to get rid of them. Under a friendly government, the vampires would be happy to buy favor through necromancy. And Fontaine can't afford to be picky. Even if the use of undead was kept secret for a time, he now has to handle a massive chaos invasion. He'll be raising every damn corpse he can find, while concealing the sheer size of this unholy practice to the best of his ability. And the political elites and enough of the public will go along with it because the alternative is having Lukas Yanovich sack the city for sure.

      Regarding point 2, the fact of the matter is that Avras is dominated by the city, and it appears to have very little unclaimed arable land nearby it (eyeballing). Aside from special foreign units (Hussars and Ascaline Guard), there is very little recruitment going on from beyond the city walls, not least because any outlying settlements will be preparing to evacuate the moment Lukas Yanovich gets close.

      As for point 3, Avras is fantasy Rome. It has a fraction of its former territory at most, judging by the official maps. It is run by a military dictator with the help of a corrupt local elite. So this is fantasy Rome in deep decline. Add to this the fact that we are in an age of gunpowder, and we get late medieval Byzantium as the best real-world analogue to base the non-supernatural elements on.
    • not really. There are more time line. The equitaine one still feudal. If we have to follow your point avras now is already of ottomans. Empire is 16century at least. With settlements overseas. Avras is a miscellaneus of a lot of things. Geografically costantinopoli but thats it. Rome of Course but also jerusalem. Is an holy city, still the center of the maps.
      And of course. I wrote about what the official fluff is at this point of the scrolls, army book and first edition bg. If you have more Officials materials about avras or byzantine avras style let me know. I only saw homebrew or home made art.