Get Rid of Hell Maw!!!

This site uses cookies. By continuing to browse this site, you are agreeing to our Cookie Policy.

The latest issue of the 9th Scroll is here! You can read all about it in the news.

Our beta phase is finally over. Download The Ninth Age: Fantasy Battles, 2nd Edition now!

  • You can stand on portal to block it.
    Actually you can only block the portal from beeing entered. So you propably need very fast units that can bypass oponents units and block the portals from beeing entered.
    The rules for leaving the portal are so forgiving, that you need a realy big unit to block the portal. Nearly impossible to do with a lot of armies.
    Rules for leaving the portal should be way more restrictive (touching the portal on leaving) and also entering the portal after a quick reform should not be possible.
  • berti wrote:

    You can stand on portal to block it.
    Actually you can only block the portal from beeing entered. So you propably need very fast units that can bypass oponents units and block the portals from beeing entered.The rules for leaving the portal are so forgiving, that you need a realy big unit to block the portal. Nearly impossible to do with a lot of armies.
    Rules for leaving the portal should be way more restrictive (touching the portal on leaving) and also entering the portal after a quick reform should not be possible.
    You need 4"x4" unit which is not that large, also you can force enemy to be placed in certain spot using way smaller units.
    My gallery: Adam painting stuff (HbE, VC and lots of terrain)
    My battle reports: Adam Battle reports
  • Adam wrote:

    berti wrote:

    You can stand on portal to block it.
    Actually you can only block the portal from beeing entered. So you propably need very fast units that can bypass oponents units and block the portals from beeing entered.The rules for leaving the portal are so forgiving, that you need a realy big unit to block the portal. Nearly impossible to do with a lot of armies.Rules for leaving the portal should be way more restrictive (touching the portal on leaving) and also entering the portal after a quick reform should not be possible.
    You need 4"x4" unit which is not that large, also you can force enemy to be placed in certain spot using way smaller units.
    You actually need a 5x5 unit. If the center of a 4x4 unit is exactly on the center of the marker, then a unit can appear exactly 1" away from you.

    In my games this weekend I was using 2 or 3 units to block a portal. at one point you run out of units and you arent "doing anything" with your army.

    Background Team

    9th Scroll Editor

    Ammertime Podcast Host
    soundcloud.com/ammertime-podcast
    Team Ireland ETC 2019 :HE:
  • Henrypmiller wrote:

    Adam wrote:

    berti wrote:

    You can stand on portal to block it.
    Actually you can only block the portal from beeing entered. So you propably need very fast units that can bypass oponents units and block the portals from beeing entered.The rules for leaving the portal are so forgiving, that you need a realy big unit to block the portal. Nearly impossible to do with a lot of armies.Rules for leaving the portal should be way more restrictive (touching the portal on leaving) and also entering the portal after a quick reform should not be possible.
    You need 4"x4" unit which is not that large, also you can force enemy to be placed in certain spot using way smaller units.
    You actually need a 5x5 unit. If the center of a 4x4 unit is exactly on the center of the marker, then a unit can appear exactly 1" away from you.
    In my games this weekend I was using 2 or 3 units to block a portal. at one point you run out of units and you arent "doing anything" with your army.
    Doesn't the unit spacing rule push you just out of that 1 inch?
    :UD: :WDG: :DE:
  • umbranar wrote:

    Henrypmiller wrote:

    Adam wrote:

    berti wrote:

    You can stand on portal to block it.
    Actually you can only block the portal from beeing entered. So you propably need very fast units that can bypass oponents units and block the portals from beeing entered.The rules for leaving the portal are so forgiving, that you need a realy big unit to block the portal. Nearly impossible to do with a lot of armies.Rules for leaving the portal should be way more restrictive (touching the portal on leaving) and also entering the portal after a quick reform should not be possible.
    You need 4"x4" unit which is not that large, also you can force enemy to be placed in certain spot using way smaller units.
    You actually need a 5x5 unit. If the center of a 4x4 unit is exactly on the center of the marker, then a unit can appear exactly 1" away from you.In my games this weekend I was using 2 or 3 units to block a portal. at one point you run out of units and you arent "doing anything" with your army.
    Doesn't the unit spacing rule push you just out of that 1 inch?
    Yes actually. This is correct. As you have to be "more than" 1" away.

    This being said. That means a 20 man elf unit cannot cover a portal...

    Background Team

    9th Scroll Editor

    Ammertime Podcast Host
    soundcloud.com/ammertime-podcast
    Team Ireland ETC 2019 :HE:
  • Caveat: I haven't played against a Hellmaw so all my comments are based on what I've seen of the rules.

    King Kazador wrote:

    Worst idea to ever make it to a fantasy table top game. Most unfun non-fantasy unit to play against.
    I don't agree with this. It looks like a good concept and something that could be fun. It may be too powerful but that is something that can be fixed by the team.

    If it was just another spell (bound or otherwise) moving units it's not the same. This is essentially tearing holes in reality so units can move around. If it it is too powerful there are a number of ways that you can solve this:
    • Costs a Veil token to create and maintain a gateway. Or Opponent gains a veil token for each - opponent gaining a veil token could more interesting as it wouldn't restrict the magic phase and it feels like it would fit the fluff - easier to siphon from the veil if there's a whacking great hole in it.
    • When opening a gateway, Roll 2 Dice and any double counts as a miscast with X Dice, where X is the number of open gateways (including the one being opened & maybe ominous gateways count double)
    • Restrict the units that can use gateways further
    • etc

    King Kazador wrote:

    Removes fantasy movement and strategy.

    King Kazador wrote:

    Automatic teleporting units goes against the entire point of playing a fantasy battle game. We place our units and then move them across the table top strategically.
    Other than ominous gateways, the gateways are opened at the end of the Magic Phase. A unit then moves through it in the next movement phase (i.e. next turn). And the charge phase after that (+1 more turn) the unit can charge.

    Overall that gives you 2 full turns to react to the opening of a gateway and a full turn to react once the gateway has been used.

    Granted that with Hellmaws with 2 ominous gateways (potentially 4 ominous gateways in total), units can use the gateways in turn 1, and potentially be on both flanks of your army. However these can only be placed outside your deployment zone so you can deploy with that in mind. And you still have a full turn to react.

    I don't think this removes strategy from the game as I don't want every army to work the same way. Hellmaws might be difficult to deal with and they might be too good in some guises but as a concept it's interesting and different. It just needs some refining.
    Never argue with Idiots. They drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.
  • Last team tournament we had I played 4 of my 5 games against Warriors.

    If I remember correctly two of them had Portals (1 Hellmaw, 2 gateways), and I got 20, 19, 16, 14 with my Vermins.

    In my opinion, the Hellmaw is awesome. It brings something new to the game that is interesting to play against and changes the pace of a match.

    Yes, it can be hard to play against, but it's not that hard to learn how it works and try to use it against them.

    I guess some people would rather whine about it on the forums then actually try to improve themselves at the game :gwhistling:

    The Swedish Championship took place a week ago, the winner was a WDG without portals. It's a strong choice, but hardly auto-pick.
    Rules Questions?

    ETC 2016 - Referee
    ETC 2017 Warm-up Herford - Head Judge
    ETC 2017 Salamanca - Head Judge
    ETC 2018 - Team Sweden - Ogre Khans
    ETC 2019 - Team Sweden
  • I find the hellmaw unique and interesting to play against. I do get to face it quite often, so I think that helps in figuring out counterplay. I find that unless my opponent plans it very well, he ends up with units a bit unsupported as they hop through the portals.

    My opinion is that portals are easier to deal with than large ambushing units. When I play against large ambushing units I often feel I have to play so conservative that I struggle to compete for the objective or to make points. Against portals I know where units can show up during my movement phase so I can plan for it. It's hard to plan for anywhere around the edge of the table for ambushers.
  • Wesser wrote:

    How does people play the practical issue of not accidentally mobning portal markers when putting units on top of one?

    My other feelings aside its the awkward shifting of models and fact that its like a whole extra phase slowmotion down the game...
    WDG have 0 shooting, more or less. So that "extra" phase of movement should do very little compared to other armies that are active in all phases.
    Rules Questions?

    ETC 2016 - Referee
    ETC 2017 Warm-up Herford - Head Judge
    ETC 2017 Salamanca - Head Judge
    ETC 2018 - Team Sweden - Ogre Khans
    ETC 2019 - Team Sweden
  • Lagerlof wrote:

    Wesser wrote:

    How does people play the practical issue of not accidentally mobning portal markers when putting units on top of one?

    My other feelings aside its the awkward shifting of models and fact that its like a whole extra phase slowmotion down the game...
    WDG have 0 shooting, more or less. So that "extra" phase of movement should do very little compared to other armies that are active in all phases.
    Its the extra time your opponent takes trying to figure out what to do, plus as the WDG player you're expected to take 2 minute turns so the other player can monopolise 98% of game time..... (Fair amount of tongue in cheek emoji)
    Take a look at my painted army so far. Feel free to share a pic of yours!

    Pics of my ever expanding warriors army

    WastelandWarrior Painting League 2019

    WastelandWarrior Painting League 2020
  • umbranar wrote:

    Henrypmiller wrote:

    Adam wrote:

    berti wrote:

    You can stand on portal to block it.
    Actually you can only block the portal from beeing entered. So you propably need very fast units that can bypass oponents units and block the portals from beeing entered.The rules for leaving the portal are so forgiving, that you need a realy big unit to block the portal. Nearly impossible to do with a lot of armies.Rules for leaving the portal should be way more restrictive (touching the portal on leaving) and also entering the portal after a quick reform should not be possible.
    You need 4"x4" unit which is not that large, also you can force enemy to be placed in certain spot using way smaller units.
    You actually need a 5x5 unit. If the center of a 4x4 unit is exactly on the center of the marker, then a unit can appear exactly 1" away from you.In my games this weekend I was using 2 or 3 units to block a portal. at one point you run out of units and you arent "doing anything" with your army.
    Doesn't the unit spacing rule push you just out of that 1 inch?
    Actually, 1 inch is slightly over 25mm so you do need a 5x5 unit.

    Or am i missing something in our rulebook that says an inch is considered as 2.5cm? @Lagerlof can you confirm?

    Background Team

    9th Scroll Editor

    Ammertime Podcast Host
    soundcloud.com/ammertime-podcast
    Team Ireland ETC 2019 :HE:
  • Henrypmiller wrote:

    Actually, 1 inch is slightly over 25mm so you do need a 5x5 unit.
    Or am i missing something in our rulebook that says an inch is considered as 2.5cm? @Lagerlof can you confirm?
    An inch is an inch yes, 2.54 cm.
    Rules Questions?

    ETC 2016 - Referee
    ETC 2017 Warm-up Herford - Head Judge
    ETC 2017 Salamanca - Head Judge
    ETC 2018 - Team Sweden - Ogre Khans
    ETC 2019 - Team Sweden
  • Marcos24 wrote:

    I prefer a hell maw in a fantasy game over a freakin helicopter
    100 % yes.

    Helicopters and STank are more immersive-breaking for me.

    I have no issues what-so-ever with the portals, I just think of that Oblivion game :D
    Rules Questions?

    ETC 2016 - Referee
    ETC 2017 Warm-up Herford - Head Judge
    ETC 2017 Salamanca - Head Judge
    ETC 2018 - Team Sweden - Ogre Khans
    ETC 2019 - Team Sweden
  • Wesser wrote:

    How does people play the practical issue of not accidentally mobning portal markers when putting units on top of one?

    My other feelings aside its the awkward shifting of models and fact that its like a whole extra phase slowmotion down the game...
    You can use portals on neoprene mats (like 2D terrain), these do not move at all and you can place units over them. Added benefit is that you can have them as 6" diameter circles so there is less measuring involved when placing units.
    My gallery: Adam painting stuff (HbE, VC and lots of terrain)
    My battle reports: Adam Battle reports

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Adam ().

  • Sounds like OP had a hard time against a hellmaw, at some point :P

    Faced the hellmaw already quite a fex times, with either DE, VS or EOS, and all games were pretty interesting, because of the extra thinking I had to put into my oponent movement phase. More surprises when you're not used to it, and more tactical unit placement when you know what to expect...

    Or a couple of good old cannon shots, and we switch to a regular game :P
    ETC 2013 - Team France NPC
    ETC 2015 - Team UN Skaven player
    ETC 2017 - Team Belgium DE player
    ETC 2018 - Team Belgium NPC
    ETC 2019 - Team Belgium NPC
  • Of course Hellmaw is interesting to play with or against, it's something unique! But again, doesn't seem to you that he's too important to the infantry playstyle? Without it and with the removal of any sort of AoE protection against shotting etc. playing an infantry list with WotDG is just painful.

    And don't you think that the portal stuff would fit better in the deamons codex? (fluff wise i mean)