Cultists Beta January 2020 feedback

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    The brand new army book for Infernal Dwarves is finally available, along with a small surprise! Remember that it is a beta version, and provide us your feedback!

    • Krokz wrote:

      Chronocide wrote:

      While this may be true, this should not be left a choice when it's such an army essential rule. Clarify the rule, please.
      It is clarified, RAI and RAW.Rules for simultaneous effect are there for a reason and we have gone through debates with RCT with it. We could clarify it more with an example.
      The issue is that it isn't obvious. It's too basic an army rule to not be obvious in how it functions.
      My army Wip blogs:
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    • I fought a couple of games now with the cultists, of which the first one was this one:



      Battle reports of the others will follow. In this game, I found out that possessed are incredibly strong, also because of the supporting magic, and the army does struggle to deal with well-armoured single models. Blazing glory are a decent option if they arrive unscathed.

      Also, it was mentioned that defensive MSU is the only playstyle available. I would guess defensive is quite inherent to an army that starts with half of its models on the table. I found so far that MMU is more valuable than MSU as it is a bit easier to manage. One screwup in your movement/bad luck roll for an enemy overrun and you're getting charged into your brazen beasts... it works a lot better if you can summon something that can actually compete with an opponent's combat block (6 clawed fiends, for example).
    • I played my first game with the below list:


      355 - Cult Leader, General, Wizard Master, Evocation, Obsidian Rock
      330 - Cult Leader, Wizard Master, Thaumaturgy
      225 - Daemon Symbiote, Wizard Apprentice, Divination, Halberd, Charged Tendrils
      240 - Daemon Symbiote, Wizard Apprentice, Divination, Halberd, Scurrying Veil
      195 - 15 Cultists, Musician, Unholy Conduit
      195 - 15 Cultists, Musician, Unholy Conduit
      195 - 15 Cultists, Musician, Unholy Conduit
      185 - 15 Cultists, Champion, Musician, Eldritch Tome
      185 - 15 Cultists, Champion, Musician, Eldritch Tome
      185 - 15 Cultists, Champion, Musician, Eldritch Tome
      210 - Ritual Altar
      410 - 24 Possessed, GWs, Red Haze, Champion, Musician
      410 - 24 Possessed, GWs, Red Haze, Champion, Musician
      590 - 5 Hoarders, Chitinous Scales, Mirrored Scales
      590 - 5 Hoarders, Chitinous Scales, Mirrored Scales
      4500


      My opponent ran the below:

      805 - Cuatl Lord, General, Alchemy, Pyromancy, Battle Standard Bearer, Essence of a Free Mind, Sun Tablet, Trained from Birth, Grasp of the Immortal
      205 - Caiman Ancient, Light Armour, Replace Halberd with Great Weapon
      205 - Caiman Ancient, Light Armour, Replace Halberd with Great Weapon
      195 - Caiman Ancient, Light Armour, Halberd
      195 - Caiman Ancient, Light Armour, Halberd
      275 - 15 Saurian Warriors, Musician
      185 - 15 Skink Braves, Shield and Poisoned Javelin, Musician
      185 - 15 Skink Braves, Shield and Poisoned Javelin, Musician
      185 - 15 Skink Braves, Shield and Poisoned Javelin, Musician
      185 - 15 Skink Braves, Shield and Poisoned Javelin, Musician
      140 - 5 Skink Hunters, Blowpipe, Vanguard
      140 - 5 Skink Hunters, Blowpipe, Vanguard
      135 - 5 Chameleons
      555 - Taurosaur, Engine of the Ancients
      455 - Taurosaur, Great Bow
      455 - Taurosaur, Great Bow
      4500



      The SA didn't fancy pushing at me, so they took up key positions around both objectives (secure target) and forced me to advance.
      Magic was surprisingly poor in both directions. I won the couple key combat engagements which were forced, picking up around 1500 points; lost only about 500 in return for a 13-7. Objective should have been a solid draw with my army piled onto the middle; but a failed Disc 8 Coldblooded panic meant I got a clutch 16-4.


      =========================================================

      Now, I don't think this was a straight test to the book, because my assumption for cultist design is they really encourage opponent to rush you - and here conflict happened T4 onward. Nevertheless, some thoughts:


      - Possessed are well-designed and every option is viable; but they feel criminally under priced at the moment. S7 AP4 with 2 attacks removes issues with characters and monsters, as they flat out can't go in there. The crappy OS / DS is relevant, but the army does have access to 2 reroll to hit spells if needed.

      - Wizards & Altar feel a bit over-saturated, but the flexibility provided is great. In theory, can probably make do with just 2 of the 3, but each setup has drawbacks. The triple-snipe (which kills high value-RnF or monsters if MR is present instead) is the main threat, Hand of Heaven & spear spam is secondary, and cheap adept with comet helps with stand-offs. Not sure I'd drop anything, even though with the core setup I get to 9 veils and its definitely OTT.

      - Altar having no 360 LoS is awkward for no reason; only affecting unboosted pentagram. Its hard to complain as its still awesome overall, but from a design perspective, I'd add that in there and increase its cost if needed.

      - Symbiotes are great. I've so far arrived at 3 main "directions" for builds:
      -> the "support wizard": needed mostly for Charged Tendrils. Sits further back and is the candidate for Adept Div if desired,
      -> the "chaff": naked guy with scurrying veil - 250 points is a bit steep for a suicide model, but its the only fast unit we have available
      -> the "fighter": Iron Husk, Essence of Mithril, 50 pt weapon enchantments to taste (from a choice of 4).

      - HOARDERS of probably any setup are fantastic with Summoning, which makes up for their usual low-mobility (by DL standards). However almost every other DL unit pays some % of its cost for its speed, which makes them a bit of a bad deal. Basically, pricing taken directly from the DL book will unfortunately feel wonky, and custom costs probably need to be applied.

      - CORE feels railroaded. The DL core units are designed to either a) be supported by DL characters (not available here) , or b) to act as scoring units mainly (not necessary here); and they require Tokens to summon which is another strike against them. In contrast, the basic cultists do the scoring, provide bunkers, provide veil tokens and magic, and power up Sacrificial Offerings. Its hard to arrive at a core setup that's better than 6x magic cultist MSU. In my game it felt over-saturated, but in hindsight I did use Sac Offerings on 3-4 units most turns, and in a rush game I expect to lose 1-2 units until the demon reinforcements turn up.

      - THE SPECIES ARCHETYPES unfortunately all feel like a downgrade from the vanilla options. This is largely driven by the Core setup issues, because all of them are a waste of space on the standard cultist when there is a price tag attached. Possessed benefit OK, although they feel a bit steep.
      Looking at my list as a case study - lots of units means I don't want 25mm unless its basically R4 for free. Have gone GWs, so The Dishonored would feel like a natural fit.
      My core would cost 180 points more (90 cultists x 2), so basically there I would drop from 6 to 5 units. Everyone gains +1 March and +1 Res, slightly harder to shoot/magic off; I lose a veil token and a unit. Not great, not terrible - not exactly worried by people shooting at cultists.
      My 2 possessed blocks go up by 72 points each, so nearly 150 total. They get better, but I now need to drop an actual piece of my army somewhere, and I'm not sure to what extent R3->4 helps them do their job. The advance/march changes are a wash.
      The symbiotes pay nothing but suffer a small downgrade (one doesn't care about the march, the other one is hanging out back; whereas the advance hurts both a bit).
      My casters pay another 30 points between them, for no real good reason.
      All in all, the perfect upgrade for my build ends up costing me 350 points, i.e. two support units - and it doesn't feel worth it.


      The issues in CAPS are ones that I feel need a look at, because they really affect build diversity.
      I won't pretend that I have the solutions, but here are some ideas:

      - Summoned demon pricing wonky-ness need repricing, with consideration tothe model's mobility. This could help with core demons somewhat as well.
      - Core and Archetypes can be alleviated by introducing a weapon option to cultists which has some ability to actually fight, even if its high ppm. Spears (no shield) and GWs come to mind - at 4 ppm, 25 cultists with a spear come to 235 pts, which then makes Wayward Children worthwhile at 260. GWs at 10 ppm makes 25 cultists with a GW come to 385, and dishonoured then takes them to 435. Neither of these units is setting the world alight, but it adds options plus lets people use more of their models.

      The post was edited 3 times, last by Squee ().

    • It was monday,back to work, neck is cramped, and then I find this wonderfull feedback and feeling happy again :thumbsup:

      Finally some time to dig in. The arhetypes! Yes, the gain vs cost is just not good. 350pts is like a lot of hitting power from DL list. What would be the ideal?

      The posseed gain most, and cultists next to nothing, save few hits on turn 1. Characters also gain like nothing as you said.

      I like the idea of weapon option to archetype cultists. Just have to check we do not add too much stuff. Idea was that even if cultists models have weapons they do not gain any bonuses from their low skill with them. But that is not working as intended as I myself do not feel shield model is working as cultist.

      The archerypes and their pricing will definitely go to the to fix list.

      Also @Ehakir I spotted also on UB when looking for cultis lists. Did search there to see what models players modelled there ;). It was all about human Cultists. And then I wathced the video too :) Great contentent!

      Lots of ideas what to try out coming with wathing the video and lists. Next for me is Wayward Children list with usage of Symbiote with Mesmerising Plumage for effective Off/Def 4/4 for possessed. (we need to make possessed or some upgrades at least a tiny bit more expensive :) )


      keep all information and thoughts coming!
    • nightwun wrote:

      Finally some time to dig in. The arhetypes! Yes, the gain vs cost is just not good. 350pts is like a lot of hitting power from DL list. What would be the ideal?
      Ah, I think you're starting at the wrong place here.

      The convenient thing is, there is only 2 units & 2 characters which are affected by the archetypes.
      The possessed are fine - there can be discussion on how many ppm each one should be, but what's there is probably not far off.
      The characters are easy as well - symbiote only pays for the thing he benefits from properly (fine). The cult leader shouldn't really pay for any of them, they are all basically irrelevant to his function.

      All you need to figure out is how you want the archetypes to interact with the basic cultists.
      Since currently the cultists have basically no combat capacity whatsoever, and don't really gain any from the archetypes, the archetypes are either irrelevant to them, or in the 25mm bases cases, a flat downgrade.

      That means the Possessed (if any present) are paying for their cost plus the cost of the cultists. i.e., to be "dwarfs", my 48 possessed will pay 144 points for themselves, and then another 150 points for the 75 or so cultists I have in core - meaning that the ppm value for that upgrade is actually 6 atm. If I only had 1 possessed unit, it would be 9 ppm! If I had no possessed units, I'd have no incentive to ever be anything but vanilla.

      So I think the "fix" there is to give the cultists some sort of combat capacity, even if minor.

      nightwun wrote:

      I like the idea of weapon option to archetype cultists. Just have to check we do not add too much stuff. Idea was that even if cultists models have weapons they do not gain any bonuses from their low skill with them. But that is not working as intended as I myself do not feel shield model is working as cultist.

      This is correct - and what weapon options are given does require some more careful thought.
      Shields are a no-no, because unstable parry unit that can house characters gets into bad design territory almost immediately. And its not very cultist-ey, I agree.
      However, weapons should be fine - keep in mind cultists are like zombies; you don't want to put them into combined fights, as they will just give away combat res most of the time. So they will largely be fighting little fights on their own merit.
      This is why I suggested GWs and Spears.
      GWs gives the chance of a cultist unit to hit back - not super hard, considering the base stats and the 25 man cap - but well enough to do the odd wound as a parting gift, or to fight other small units. Its also just a generic two-hander, i.e. not fancy or military-like. This unit then starts benefiting from either of the R4 upgrades, as more models survive and get to hit back.
      Spears lets the unit fight off chaff and maybe other small units, by virtue of the Agi bonuses, and in turn makes Wayward Children more worthwhile. Its also not all that military - its the weapon you give to random peasants; especially when its not used with a shield.
      Kinslayers benefits both types, but by a very small margin. That upgrade being free for everyone makes sense.



      The other direction you can take if you don't want combat capacity, is to make the upgrades per unit for the cultists - basically lowering their costs to under 1 ppm - where they may just be worthwhile for either the R4 or the Adv5 on their own merits. Kinslayers still useless unfortunately. This is neater and doesn't expand your currently complexity, but it doesn't sort out your problems with core in general - which could be fine if the DL unit repricing hits the core units correctly.
    • Ehakir wrote:

      I fought a couple of games now with the cultists, of which the first one was this one:


      Regarding your comment in the video about bretonians, try summoning Bloat Flies. Suicidal unit, but they destroy blocks of res 3 knights. One of the few DL units that would really benefit from the summoning rules (placing them in front of a charging unit is pretty ideal for them).
      My army Wip blogs:
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    • I feel like the core cultist could also have a weapon option similar to as follows:

      Corrupted Daggers
      Poison Attacks, +1 AP
      On a natural to hit roll of "1", the model bearing the weapon suffers a hit distributed onto the model's unit health pool.

      It is unholy, thematically fitting (not military at all to use poison) and rule wise appealing, making cultists still unreliable, but able to score some lucky unholy hits.

      I, again, can't fit into my head the idea of a cult that basically completely consists of idiots without any means of defense, given that they can't (lore wise) always rely on summoning demons.
      cuncta fluunt
    • Chronocide wrote:

      Could make custom cultist weapons. How about:
      (1-handed) Way Too Sharp Ritual Blades
      Mundane Close combat Weapon
      AP 2, Hit Rolls of 1 wound the wielder's unit instead of the target enemy unit and are at a further +1 to wound. Enchants as Hand Weapon.

      (2-handed) Way Too Sharp Ritual Blades
      Mundane Close combat Weapon
      +1 Str, AP 2, Hit Rolls of 1 wound the wielder's unit instead of the target enemy unit and are at a further +1 to wound. Enchants as Halberd.

      (silly weapons, thinking about this army puts me in a silly mood. So the unit is just hurting themselves a good chunk of the time...)
      My army Wip blogs:
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    • While we summon daemons I would like to some extent keep two thigs about realism: Scale of power and fighting cababilities.
      So for scale a basic cultis should be less skilled than EoS infantryman of his people. I think this is represented with offensive and defensive and also with discipline. Discipline does not meanin willingness to die but ability to do moves on the battlefiels like combat reform and march test.

      On the other hand fighting cababilities include the access to certain equipment and their ease of use. As I often like to do watched a video (I like looking for background material, as all good designs are based on stuff we can understand.)

      so it was this

      Spear and shield + club. Nothing surprising there, if you think about it, but watching videos is fun. With those weapons we can arm some people not aimed for formation fighting and do some harm.

      I know we all do not share the same vision about "reality" as these guys summon Daemons and call down Wrath of God. I still feel cultist should be as down to earth as possible.

      That being said I would rather give +2 def with shield than parry. Maybe that would not be too complicated? And spear is spear anyway.
    • Another game from me, results in a shameful 18-2 loss against Asklanders.

      Bad on paper, but it was closer than it looked - 1-2 crucial rolls went against me, and he ended up holding on steadfast/instability-popping me exactly/etc.I got tabled but still killed ~2.5k worth of stuff. Its also worth noting I let me opponent "resurrect" his BSB after he killed himself by hitting hoarders with crush attacks, as he didn't realize it bounces the entire attack - so that result in a "tournament" setting was probably closer to 10-10 if I wanted to be a poo

      Thoughts:

      - Red Haze on the GW possessed was there to threaten characters; but its likely overkill and makes them struggle with fighting random things (and taking casualties at range) and occasionally killing some of your own doesn't help. Direct exchange for chitinous scales is likely a better setup for the same points.

      - Symbiotes are 3HP, not 4 (I misread this somehow!). Doesn't change my overall opinion of them, but ill be dropping the chaff guy for now to try out some things.

      - I hadn't realised, but the Div auras from an adept symbiote have an absolutely ridiculous area - the presence of 6 other wizards nearby makes them range 24"(!!!). With that in mind, the tendrils dude gets an upgrade.


      Revised list:

      330 - Cult Leader, General, Wizard Master, Evocation
      330 - Cult Leader, Wizard Master, Thaumaturgy
      305 - Daemon Symbiote, Wizard Adept, Divination, Halberd, shield, Charged Tendrils
      195 - 15 Cultists, Musician, Unholy Conduit
      195 - 15 Cultists, Musician, Unholy Conduit
      195 - 15 Cultists, Musician, Unholy Conduit
      185 - 15 Cultists, Champion, Musician, Eldritch Tome
      185 - 15 Cultists, Champion, Musician, Eldritch Tome
      185 - 15 Cultists, Champion, Musician, Eldritch Tome
      210 - Ritual Altar
      425 - 25 Possessed, GWs, Chitinous Scales, Champion, Musician
      410 - 24 Possessed, GWs, Chitinous Scales, Champion, Musician
      590 - 5 Hoarders, Chitinous Scales, Mirrored Scales
      590 - 5 Hoarders, Chitinous Scales, Mirrored Scales
      170 - 5 Eidolons
      4500

      Going to try out some Eidolons to either 1) use as suicide chaff in T1 if needed - and their shots should make up for the veil token, or 2) if not under immediate threat, lay down some damage.

      EDIT: dropping useless 20 pts (dragonbane gem) for 49th possessed

      The post was edited 1 time, last by Squee ().

    • Squee wrote:

      - I hadn't realised, but the Div auras from an adept symbiote have an absolutely ridiculous area - the presence of 6 other wizards nearby makes them range 24"(!!!). With that in mind, the tendrils dude gets an upgrade.
      Not sure what this means. Divination's The Conclave is capped to 3 other wizards. They're still good auras, but I have no idea why 6 wizards would do anything special, even for cultists.
      My army Wip blogs:
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    • Game 3!

      Played against a full-on Dark Hide DL list - Scourge, Courtesan, 2x 6 Fiends, 2 units of Furies, 2 core blocks.
      Objective was Capture the Flags (I understandably lost this - 10 scoring units, most of which squishy, vs his 4).
      End result was 13-7 to me, after I removed the DL army, but lost about 40% of mine and the objective.

      Thoughts:

      - Possessed with Scales indeed seem to work better than with Red Haze, even when there are big targets about and enough AP to nullify the armour in half the combats. The odd save here and there on a 5+ or 6+, and not hitting yourself, really helps. Red Haze is still great to have, but I now suspect its there to pair with the spears.

      - The strongest thing in my list by far are the units of Hoarders (this game they beat up the fiends which are supposedly meant to hunt things like them), which makes me think the cultist book is not quite as bent as I thought - DL can bring the same 1200 pts of elite fighting power, they can bring the same magic lores and dice advantage out of their characters (for twice the cost, but their core doesn't need to get involved), and don't suffer from always taking 2nd turn.

      - at least with my playstyle, the Divination auras have been really good, despite the high casting values (4 dice + sacrifice is still on the iffy end for my taste). Its common there are 3 combats going on at once that are all in range.

      - Eidolons did well - as expected, they got summoned as suicide chaff, but 170 points and a veil for that is kind of acceptible considering they drop 5 S4 hits in the turn beforehand (this game, it was a wound on the Scourge).
    • Squee wrote:


      - at least with my playstyle, the Divination auras have been really good, despite the high casting values (4 dice + sacrifice is still on the iffy end for my taste). Its common there are 3 combats going on at once that are all in range.
      Divination is my favorite lore for DL.
      My army Wip blogs:
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    • New

      Hello there!

      First game with my cultist army this afternoon, friendly game against KoE
      - Duke, general with Virtue of renown and lot of magic item
      - BsB, with questing oath and bastard sword
      - Damsel druidism adept
      - 8 knights of the realm Champion, Musician, standard bearer
      - 8 Knights of the realm Champion, Musician, standard bearer
      - 8 Knights of the Grail Champion, Musician, standard bearer (banner of the last charge)
      - 5 Yeoman Outriders bow
      - Trebuchet

      My cultists army:
      - Cult leader, Master of Ritual, Fallen Heroes, Wizard master of Occultism, talisman of the void, Ledger of Souls
      - Daemon Symbiot, Fallen heroes, Wizard adept divination, basalt infusion, shield Breaker, Paired weapon, hammer hand
      - 20 Cutists, Musician, champion, Fallen heroes, Eldritch tome
      - 15 Cultists, musician, Fallen heroes, Unholy conduit
      - 13 Lemures, musician
      - 25 Possessed, Fallen heroes, Musician, Champion, great weapons, Chitinous scales
      - Ritual altar
      - Profane Idol
      - Hope Harvester

      Deployment: Counterthrust
      Secondary Objective: Hold the ground

      I choose my side, my Opponent start.
      I deploy my cultists+Cult leader in the middle of the table with possessed+Daemon Symbiot on the right flank, idol on the left flank.
      My opponent deploy a KotR+duke on the middle, the second KotR+BSB on his left, and the Grail knights on his right, Trebuchet behind, YO on the extreme left.

      Turn 1 KoE, he advance with everybody and prepare the objective, the trebuchet kill 9 cultists in the small unit.
      Turn 1 C, My opponent do a big mistake, the KotR+bsb is at 13" of the possessed, I try the charge and pass it! I charge Grail knights with my idol. On magic i have 22 veil token (thanks to the ledger of soul!!! I Summon lemures for chaff the KotR+duke and do absolutley nothing with my 9 magic dice (a really unlucky dices rolls). during the melee phase, Idol loose 4HP (wound+insta), and possessed win the fight but KotR+BsB pass their break test.

      Turn 2 KoE, KotR and Duke charge the Lemures unit, the trebuchet do an indirect hit on cultists and kill 3 more. Melee Phase, possessed kill all KotR and the bsb flee. I reform them for see the flank of the second unit of KotR engaged with Lemure. Duke and KotR kill only 2 Lemures, and the grail roll very badly and the idol survive with 1HP.
      Turn 2 C, Possessed charge the flank of KotR, in magic phase I summon the hope harvester, and pass only the pentagram of pain of the ritual altar who make 0 damage, all others spell are disspeled or miss. I shoot Yeoman with my Hope harvester and kill only 1 of them with 23 shoots... damned!In melee, possessed and Lemures make a small victory against KotR but they hold on. Idol die... finally.

      Turn 3 KoE, Grail Knights charge the small Cultist unit who flee, he have no other target and miss the charge. He rally His BsB, In melee, my Daemon Symbiot kill the duke in duel, i win the fight by 5, he flee and i make a pursuit with my lemures and destroy the survivors (yeah!)
      Turn 3 C,I charge the trebuchet with the Lemure unit but I will not kill it this turn, i replace my possessed for see the rear of my culist and cult leader unit i put all my magic and shoots in the grail unit and i kill only 4 of them.

      Turn 4 KoE, He charge the rear of my cultist and Cult leader unit with his BsB alone. He replace his Grail unit and res 1 of them with druidism. Lemures don't kill the trebuchet, again, The BsB kill lot of cultists.
      Turn 4 C, I can't Charge the BsB with possessed because i can't do a Wheel so i move them for repare this mistake, i use my Hope harvester for Chaff the Grail knights unit. In melee lemure don't kill the trebuchet -_- and the BsB continue to reduce the cultists unit.

      Turn 5 KoE, He charge the hope harvester and will destroy it, the BsB kill all cultist and let my Cult leader woth 2HP, the lemure finish the trebuchet (alleluia).
      Turn 5 C, i Charge the BsB with my possessed unit and will kill him before he can finisch my cult leader

      Turn 6 KoE, he charge my cult leader with Grail knights, i Flee and he impact my possessed unit during the charge move. He kill lot of them but i kill all knights except one and the damsel.
      Turn 6 C, My possessed kill the last grail knights, we stop here, my opponent have only his damsel.

      14-6 for the cultists, I have the objectif so i win 17-3.

      My opinion on the L.A; Very fun to play, but a bit weak I think:
      The +
      Summon is really strong i think the rule work well like that. Cultist are good too, the 3 ameliorations are all usefull. The magic is really cool and strong.
      The -
      no BsB and a weak discipline make this army really random, i think that an artefact for reroll or minimise discipline test can be very usefull. Same for magic, a way for have bonus, like daemon legion or hightborn elfe will be welcome.
      Ritual Altar are not very usefull, allow it to use spell at 360°, or if he can double his summon range?
      Possessed are strong, but off def 2 is really disabling, they are elit cultist so why they don't have 3?

      Thank for you job
    • New

      Tyran wrote:

      Possessed are strong, but off def 2 is really disabling, they are elit cultist so why they don't have 3?
      Just an explanation. Daemons don't know how to use physical tools like weapons very good, even controlling a physical body feels very alien to them, this is representing in their low Weapon Skill. Imagine how crude a child is with his body, only after prolonged exposure to the world neural pathways are formed and moving his body becomes natural to a person.
      With Possessed they let Daemons inside them before the battle or a day before, while a Daemon Symbiote is here for years, sometimes even decades (hence Symbiote) and has higher weapon skill because he is used to the physical world.

      Don't forget 'normal' stats for Cultists are S3 and 1 Attack. So Possessed (or Devil Monks as in fluff text) exchange strength and speed for crudeness. This makes for a very unique elite infantry: low weapon skill, strong physical force.
    • New

      Krokz wrote:

      Tyran wrote:

      Possessed are strong, but off def 2 is really disabling, they are elit cultist so why they don't have 3?
      Just an explanation. Daemons don't know how to use physical tools like weapons very good, even controlling a physical body feels very alien to them, this is representing in their low Weapon Skill. Imagine how crude a child is with his body, only after prolonged exposure to the world neural pathways are formed and moving his body becomes natural to a person.With Possessed they let Daemons inside them before the battle or a day before, while a Daemon Symbiote is here for years, sometimes even decades (hence Symbiote) and has higher weapon skill because he is used to the physical world.

      Don't forget 'normal' stats for Cultists are S3 and 1 Attack. So Possessed (or Devil Monks as in fluff text) exchange strength and speed for crudeness. This makes for a very unique elite infantry: low weapon skill, strong physical force.
      Yes, thank you, it's logic indeed. But Off 3 Def 2 can represent their clumsiness and ferocity in combat